Windows 10: GPT vs MBR

And that, to me, is even worse. If it is there for a reason, I want to see it!

 

Agreed. I still had the funniness of Disk Management showing duplicate partition entries in the table above the graphic in my Win10 Upgraded system. As I understand it, Disk Management is not entirely "up to snuff" on GPT disks. Of course, this problem went away when I blew all partitions away during the clean install and my 7 partitions was reduced to 3 plus the MSR.

At this point my Macrium Reflect scheduled monthly full, weekly differential, and daily incremental imaging would be my first resort and I have looking at going without recovery partitions. etc., to the extent possible (staying with GPT) on my bucket list.

 

First, there is no such thing as EFI BIOS - firmware is either UEFI (EFI was depreciated in 2005, although people (even Intel) still refer to EFI) or BIOS. That's just the code to get the hardware up and running.

The EFI System partition (ESP) must be FAT - that's just how it works. For one thing, it allows other OSes to boot.

Do you need the Recovery partition - if you created a Recovery Drive then no you don't NEED it. You can forget about booting into advanced startup (troubleshoot, refresh, reset, .....) if you don't have it. You'll have to boot to the Recovery Drive you created. The OEM Recovery part - I make Recovery media and then remove that partition - some people want to keep it around.

I don't understand the apprehension people have over GPT - it's just a disk partitioning technology. It was developed as part of the UEFI standard to overcome the limitations of MBR.
Configure UEFI/GPT-Based Hard Drive Partitions
Windows and GPT FAQ - Windows 10 hardware dev

UEFI celebrated it's 10th anniversary this year, so it's not exactly new technology. GPT has been in common use since 2010, although not widespread use - probably because people don't see any advantage.

For me - just removing the 4 partition limitation is a huge advantage. Large drives can easily be partitioned into smaller chunks (easier maintenance and more even use of the space ... how many times does the head fly out past a huge C: drive?) Partitioning the drive to store data further out on the disk allows me to put ISOs, System images and other non-essential files far away from every day program access. Other more frequently used data is stored closer to the head access and everyday data (Docs, Music, Pics, Video) are stored closest to the system partition. I don't need my drive working hard to get past seldom used files just to find frequently used files. But that can also be accomplished with a MBR initialized drive using an extended partition and logical drives. The advantage is that you don't have to muck about creating the extended partition.

GPT has a bit of redundancy and is going to be the standard moving forward.
The disk schema (WinRE, EFI, MSR, WinPart, Recovery) straightens out some of the mess (System Reserve - System Part + Recovery or WinPart + Recovery) ... the word Recovery itself is a bit confusing. There's Windows Recovery Environment (WinRE), OEM Recovery, and Windows OS Recovery. They can all be munged together or separated depending on the OEM or inidiviaul who establishes the schema.

Each partition as a specific function under GPT. Sure you can create a proper disk schema with MBR, but Windows creates the proper schema if your system is UEFI based and you clean install. OEMs .... maybe, but I've seen a whole slew of screwy OEM disk schemas.

You can partition the disk however you want - one huge Win partition or OS and a few data partitions to level the seek access times.

In the end, I defer to the firmware and the OS. If your firmware is UEFI, you'll get a GPT initialized disk on a clean Windows install. If your firmware is BIOS, you'll get an MBR initialized disk on a clean Windows install.

Why not let the OS decide what it wants based on the firmware? You really shouldn't even notice the difference unless you need to dig really deep into the disk structure.

 

Ok folks, after thinking about which partition format I will use on this new computer I have decided to keep the GPT partitions.
I have already cleaned up one of the partitions, D-drive. Now I want to clean up the C-drive and remove at least 1 of the 2 recovery partitions. I of them is about 1gig!!!!! I am using MiniTool, I am not sure which partitions I MUST have, and which ones I can remove safely I will post a screen shot, and listen to anyone's thoughts. Thanks.

 

Ok, got tired of waiting for any answers, so just starting playing with MiniTool. I removed the 2 recovery partitions, removing the one at the end, was simple and easy. Removing the recovery partition at the front, was very tricky.
Had to change positions of the fat partition, and apply change, then copy the 128meg partition in front of the recovery partition I wanted to remove, then apply that change. Finally got to the point where I could delete that recovery partition and extend my primary drive partition. I gained over a gig and a half of hard drive space for my primary partition which is an SSD. Computer seems to even boot faster than ever now. restart is about 24 sec's.

 

Only thing I still have a question on is that 128meg partition?? Now says its unformatted, where before it did not?? It also said it was a GPT reserved, now it says NONE?? But system boots fine, don't see any problems, yet. Should I leave everything alone now, or try to make some kind of change to that 128MB partition???

 

Mike and all

Thanks for all you post about GPT, MBR and any info about the working of partitions and why some HD have more partitions than others. please keep posting we are reading and learning... Cliff M.

 

The 1str part was your Windows Recovery Environment, you should have left that one alone.
The 2nd part was your EFI System - that should have remained where it was
The 3rd part was your Microsoft System Reserve, you should have left that alone too
---> I can't tell waht it is now, looks like it's not much oaf anything, being unallocated.
---> KYHI is probably the member with the answer on the MSR part, he knows more about this than I do, I have a lot of catching up to do with reagrds to UEFI/GPT

The 4th part was your Windows drive
The 5th part was your OEM recovery - not sure why it's only 450 MB. That size looks more like Windows RE and it's far too small for an OEM recovery (Windows + OEM bloat = Previous OSes were noramlly 12-16 GB on HP machines).

Did the machine come with a separate HP Recovery Drive?

Please post more deatials about the parts

Lauch Command Prompt (Admin)
Diskpart
sel dis 0
lis par

** for each par listed, sel par #, then with the par in focus (selected), show the details
sel par #
det
det par

grab the text (right click the cmd title bar, select edit, pick Select all ... select edit, pick copy)

Post the text in a code box (# on the TF post menu)

exit diskpart
exit the cmd prompt.

Thanks, I'm not sure if I have any recommendations/suggestions other than a wipe and clean install (no one wants to hear that *Wink )

 

Ok, you answered kinda late, as I have made those changes already. But, like I always do, I have an image backup of the drive before I made the changes. Now to answer some of your questions. The 1st part was windows restore, I have no reason to want any restore partition!! That is/was fine to remove. EFI system is still their, works fine, 3rd part is also STILL their MSR partition. Actually was the same as before, just copied it from one place to where it is now, and before it was unallocated. So whatever was in that 128 meg partition, is still their, being unallocated, not sure what could be in their. 5th part was again, a recovery partition. No need for ANY recovery partition. That's why I make image backups!!!!!!!
If I messed up the boot partition, or any important partition that windows 10 needed, I don't think I would have been able to boot back to my desktop in 24 sec's. Also have rebooted several more times since then.

 

Also tried those commands, diskpart did not recognize some of them. did report that the system partition 1 was healthy. (fat 32)

that's when the other commands you posted didn't work.

 

@OldMike65
If you open Admin command prompt and run: reagentc /info. You might find that you broke the recovery environment
@Slartybart

This partition was created during the upgrade from 8 => 10 and Winre.wim which contains a set of recovery tools, initially was in partition 1 and now resides in partition 5 with a new set of tools for Windows 10 after the upgrade.

 

why do I NEED the recovery environment??????

 

Ran that command and it said windows RE Disabled. Which is fine with me, as I don't want it.

 

Listen guys I do want your input!! AND I can restore everything back the way it was before I made those changes to my C-drive. Would take me about 6 mins to restore. But.........why should I if everything is working??????

 

The partition that I am a little worried about is the 2nd partition (128mg) but with that one all I did was move it from one place to another place, didn't change anything about it, just moved it.