Windows 10: Requesting Advice On First PC Purchase

Thanks to all for the warning about my el-cheapo budget. I don't disagree with anything that's been said, but at this very early stage in my Windows career, I'm just not willing to invest too much in the experiment.

My needs are more complex so I'll still be spending most of my time on my iMac, but my wife uses our laptop for literally nothing other than web surfing, so we do have use for a cheap PC.

There is another issue, which applies to all computers, imho. It seems nobody can sell a truly reliable machine which you can count on. Sure, some machines in any model will work flawlessly for years, but you never know which one that will be. You might get the gem, you might get the lemon, who knows. It's a crapshoot, no matter what you buy, no matter how much you spend, new or used, mac or PC.

Thus, I've been gravitating towards cheaper machines over the years, so I don't have to sweat it so much. As example, I can buy four or five $300 laptops for the cost of one new Mac laptop. It seems to me the odds are better with four machines than just one.

I would still be buying cheap used Macs, except that the vendor I was using turned out to be a snake oil salesman operation, and I don't know of any reliable alternative at the moment. Thus, it's time to open my mind and explore the PC realm. Anyway, that's how I got here.

This is a most excellent article, and I thank you very much for it. Very appropriate to my question, and I expect to find it quite useful. Well done!

 

Do you really need a laptop? Could you use a desktop instead?
Unlike a cheap laptop, a cheap desktop PC can be very reliable.

And you get a lot more for your money.
And you get a screen you can actually see.
And a keyboard you can actually use.
And a real mouse.
And more horsepower.
And a DVD/Blue Ray disk.
And more memory.
And more storage.

 

I'd second this approach. There are lots of ex-business laptops around and $300 will get you a decent 4ish year old Lenovo Thinkpad. It will be far better than a equivalently priced new machine.

Ebay is cheaper if you are willing to risk it - I did recently and was very happy with the result.

 

That's me 100% I definitely don't need portability of hardware, so its always been a desktop for me. I have two large USB ext. HDDs for duplicate backups of the whole system and all personal files (Documents. etc.,) although I suspect a laptop owner could have the same.

 

Interesting point, I hadn't considered that, even though the situation is similar on the Mac side.

Well, yes, a laptop is what would serve our particular family situation best at the moment. But your point is taken, we're going to have to pay a price for the mobility.

That said, I'm not dismissing this consideration for the next purchase. I do a lot of video work and would like to access Windows based tools. Perhaps that will be the excuse to buy a desktop PC too.

"Oh honey, the expert guys on the forum say we have to buy two new computers, so I guess I'll just have to get a desktop PC too."

Yep, that's the plan. I see it now. I'll blame it all on you.

 

Ok, this option remains on the table. We do have a local Best Buy. Any opinions on Best Buy? I don't have a good impression of them actually, but I don't remember why. I think I have it stuck in my head to cut out the middlemen and buy directly from the computer maker. I'm wary of all business situations where a buck of blame can be passed off to somebody else. But I'm still listening, perhaps I'm just being paranoid and stubborn.

Ebay is a bridge too far for me, but I am open to buying used from a reliable used vendor who actually, serious, really, no kidding, tests the machines before resale. So, now I'm arguing with what I just said in the paragraph above.

Is there perhaps a reliable company with good rep who specializes in selling used PCs?

 

I'll mention here that refurbished may not be a bad thing, I've had good service from such deals with printers. Frequently refurbished only means the product was purchased and the serial number entered into a database at the time of purchase meaning if the product got returned for whatever reason it cannot again be sold as new. As long as the warranty is the same as if new the buyer's chances are the same. Sometimes off-lease are good deals.

 

I think you're right. The last used Mac vendor I used claimed to be testing the machines before re-sale, but once they shipped me three broken machines in a row with very easily discovered problems, it became clear the testing claim was an explicit lie. In other words, the machines weren't "refurbished" at all, but only resold. I might as well have been buying them off Ebay.

It became hilarious in the end. Machine #2 came with a major problem (won't bore you with it) which couldn't be resolved by the vendor. So they tried to play the role of hero and said, we'll send you another even better machine as a replacement! Machine #3 arrived with a dead monitor. Obviously they hadn't turned it on even once.

They then said, no problem, just return the machine. I said, sure no problem, my fee for shipping your broken untested junk around the country is $100 plus shipping. They balked for a couple weeks, but in the end paid that fee.

I've been a big advocate of used machines for some time, but have basically grown somewhat suspicious of vendors who sell them.

Well, chances aren't really the same, because the original buyer presumably returned the machine for some reason. If that reason was found and fixed, ok, that could work. The problem is, how do we know the vendor actually really did find and fix the problem? Because they say so? You basically have to buy a number of used machines from a vendor before you'll know what the deal really is.

 

Ok, this comment wins the day.

I was reading the reviews of the $300 laptops, and found one they thought was good. So I go to Amazon to scan the buyer reviews. Uh oh, not a pretty picture. Lots and lots of unhappy campers, and not over little things.

So obviously it's a get what you pay for deal, which makes sense. But...

There seems to be no way to solve this problem in a manner one can have confidence in.

About a dozen years ago I bought a brand new $2000 Mac directly from Apple, supposedly the highest quality computer maker. Yep, you guess it, died an incurable death about a year out of warranty.

On the other hand, we have two old circa 1997 Macs (current market value about $20) upstairs that are still working perfectly every day after all these years. Ok, they're really slow by today's standards, but they still work just as well as the day they came out of the box.

So I tried buying used Macs from a used Mac vendor on the theory that 4 cheap used Macs are more reliable than a single new one. Good theory, really lame vendor, with no credible competitors.

So ok, buying a $300 laptop is likely a bad plan. I can agree with that.

But what's the alternative plan?

I have no idea. It seems to be a roll of the dice crapshoot no matter what you buy, or who you buy it from, or how much you pay.

Maybe I'll buy a hundred $10 used machines and just keep throwing them away one after the other until I find the magic gem.

No, wait, I've got it! I'll stop computing and go back to reading books from the library!

 

Reading that quote, all I can say is "Au contraire Mon Fraire".

I've been building and setting up new PC's since ~1980. Before I retired, I made a pretty good living at it.
I can generally build a better PC than I could buy in any store. My current PC, that I'm on now, uses an 8 core AMD CPU, and a SSD hard drive, and six GB of RAM memory, and it's faster than most of the new PC's I'm called on to set up for my friends/customers.
(even after I've tweaked and tuned them for maximum efficiency)

If a Windows PC is lagging, dragging, or just not running up to expectations, it's usually because it was never set up properly.
I spend a lot of time tweaking and tuning every PC that I set up, so that it runs as fast as possible. Windows is usually the problem, not the hardware.

A MAC definitely has it's place in the overall scheme of things, but it's not for the average user. I have one friend who was given a MAC by her son. She runs it, but she hates it!

Happy Trails, Mates!
*Cool

 

A key problem for Mac users is that while the Mac once was the exclusive focus of Apple, today two thirds of Apple's profits come from the iPhone.

The iPhone Generates Almost Two-Thirds Of Apple's Profit - Business Insider

 

I realize that buying off of eBay can sometimes be a crap shoot, but it really is the only way to go for a cheap but good laptop, like others have said. Look into used business models such as Dell Latitude, Dell Precision (likely not in your price point, but still a good look), HP ProBook or EliteBook.

I purchased a Dell Precision M4800 in about February of this year from eBay. Paid over $600 for it all together, and couldnt be happier with the purchase. Business/commercial grade laptops are built far sturdier than home or consumer grade. They feature better, more robust hardware, the chassis are often constructed out of metal rather than plastic, and the biggest thing, the hinges are made larger, heavier and also out of metal so they last much longer.

Buying a sub $300 laptop is... honestly its just asking for trouble. You will sub par performance, a sub par screen, sub par built in audio, just.... sub par everything. It will feel very clunky, very flimsy. It will be something like "Well, lets just toss this together without care and sell it." I would almost put money on my claim that my 3-4 year old Precision that I bought for ~$600 will kick the absolute crap out of any new laptop for the same price.

 

Yep, I get that now, agreed. The search for a $300 laptop has been cancelled. And I thank everyone here for helping me think it through.

I realize my error now. I was willing to accept low performance in exchange for a low price, and thought that was the end of it. I really should have known better. While low performance is indeed acceptable for this purchase, lame junk cheapo hardware that explodes 2 months after purchase definitely isn't. In the Amazon reviews for one of the supposedly "best" cheap laptops I read many such reports, and it slapped me out of my wishful thinking dream.

A business class refurb is still on the table, so I'll aim my research in that direction for now.