Windows 10: AHCI still not fixed???

well, that isn't technically correct. ahci isn't a poor performer with pcie drives, it just isn't GENERALLY as fast as nvme. keep in mind that nvme is extremely new. it is as new as new can get in this industry. but it normally does out perform ahci. however, in recent tests, the ahci sm951 out performed the intel nvme 750. so nvme isn't across the board faster than ahci, although its upside is much brighter.

some of this information is old, and written before my current drive even came out. they mention what is coming in april, when we are currently in june. most of the information is good in these articles, but things are moving really quickly in this part of the industry, and so even a few months can make the information dated.

 

HERE IS A QUOTE FROM A VERY RECENT ARTICLE OF A BENCHMARK CONTEST BETWEEN SEVERAL SSD DRIVES FROM TECHSPOT


"Not only is the SM951 faster but it's also cheaper -- around 10% when comparing the 512GB model to Intel's SSD 750 Series 400GB. Granted, at $0.89 per gig the SM951 isn't an affordable proposition, but it's a better overall value than the performance SATA SSDs. Samsung's SSD 850 Pro 512GB is $270 ($0.52 per gigabyte) and while the SM951 costs ~70% more, it's well over 70% faster.The only real issue facing Samsung's SM951 is availability, as it seems the only way to get one is from RamCity (directly or through its Amazon store). Right now the company appears to have plenty of stock and offers a three-year warranty. That being the case, if I were looking to outfit my enthusiast rig with a high-speed PCIe SSD, Samsung's SM951 would be my number one choice.
90
TECHSPOT
SCORE
Pros: Samsung's SM951 is a better value than performance SATA SSDs when you consider it's twice as fast, not to mention that it's quicker and cheaper than Intel's NVMe-equipped SSD 750 1.2TB.
Cons: Availability is limited, but if you want one you can buy it. Drive ships with a three-year warranty vs. Intel's five-year coverage. Lack of NVMe might be a bummer but a new model is coming soon."


the above quotes are from here: Samsung SM951 PCIe SSD 512GB Review > How We Test - TechSpot

this is just one example of ahci hanging with, and even beating nvme in many bench tests. the point is that ahci is not dead or a poor performer, it is just older tech, and doesn't have the long term abilities that nvme has. right now it isn't prudent to buy nvme, because most computers don't have a bios to boot from them, and who knows how long before they will. and if you can't boot from it... so good things are coming, but i'll stick to my sm951 for the time being. and windows ten should join the game and update their drivers.

 

You still have not presented any information indicating a problem with Windows 10, that there is some kind of bug, or what exact problem you are referring to...

 

my aim wasn't to PRESENT information about win 10's ahci shortcomings in this, it was to point it out. gabe and the boys at win 10 dev already know that these problems exist, as several "windows 10" specific articles have been pointing them out for a few months now. i was merely bumping the point by making mention of it here again, hoping to light a fire under their tails to get it done. these drives don't need a specific driver to run properly. they need the general ahci system drivers to work properly for them to operate at full performance. the windows ten ahci system drivers are not optimized as they should be for an os getting ready for rtm. my drive performs much slower in win 10 than it does in windows 7 or 8.1 because of the windows 10 ahci problems. and they've known about it for a while now.

 

I'm guessing he's referring to the lack of good inbuilt driver support for his hardware in Win 10. Since there are no Windows 10 drivers available yet for most hardware, we rely implicitly on Microsoft to insure compatibility, especially with the latest hardware.

EDIT: My sound is a good example. It's functional, but I cant even adjust the volume, and the manufacturer doesn't intend to make new drivers. So I will soon replace my PC sound.

 

Ok, so you come here to complain about a problem you refuse to properly explain, refuse to provide any references to support your claim of a problem, and then argue about how Windows 10 needs to fix this vaguely referenced, unsupported claim.

Ok... gotcha.

 

what is your problem? i explained aptly why i made the post, and you refuse to accept it, and instead try to start a flame war? grow up. this board isn't for that. if you don't like what i posted, don't read it. i went through 40 or 50 different documents while doing my research, and NO, i'm not going through all of it again just to satisfy your curiosity. do your own research.
MY POST WAS NOT AIMED AT YOU OR FOR YOU. my post was to point out something the win 10 guys have not fixed, in hopes that they would get it done. your approval of the situation isn't part of the equation. so find someone else to argue with, i'm not on here for that purpose.

 

First, you did not simply post here to notify people of a problem. You asked specifically for information about the problem being fixed, and since nobody else seems to know about this problem we asked you for more specific information about it, which you have failed to provide in enough detail to know what you're talking about.

Let me remind you of what you asked:

My problem is that you claim something needs to be fixed and is broken, but refuse to provide any supporting evidence for it.

Is it too much to ask you to reference one of these specific posts you claim are so plentiful (but I can't seem to find with any google search)? Why are you so resistant to supplying that information?

The only posts I can find are ones which talk about the AHCI protocol itself having performance issues. Nothing about Windows 10 in particular.

As far as I'm concerned, there is no issue to be fixed, and nothing you've said or presented contradicts that belief. We only have your vague and inspecific claims. Great, you don't care what I think... but come on... What if I started telling you I had read somewhere that your fancy new SSD was going to melt if you used a cell phone next to it.... you'd demand proof as well, would you not?

This is all i'm going to say on the matter, unless you get more specific.

 

Now, now, thinking that MS can fix all the problems with drivers is just unrealistic, as much as we would like to have only one to blame. Traditionally, MFGs of HW are responsible for developing drivers and utilities for their products. MS provides just the base and APIs for them. Anybody remembers how DOS used to work ? Every program had to separately support all but basic HW. Fortunately there was not great variety of HW back than.
If it continued like that, with all the different HW now, every program would be size of today's windows. Generic drivers introduced in later Windows could never provide full functionality of devices and still can't. Even years may and did pass before some drivers were brought to their maximum and some never did.
Questions about proper drivers for new HW and specially new technology, should really be directed to developers of such devices as only they are responsible for their support. If they can't get their stuff to work properly on an OS, who can and/or has to be responsible ?

 

the thing you painfully don't seem to be able to grasp is that no one is trying to prove anything to you. who are you? do your own research. if you can't find anything, then learn how to do research on the net. i asked if anyone has found anything about them fixing it. if you haven't, then there was no need for you to respond. if you don't agree with it, there was no need for you to respond. but clearly, you seem to have some deficiency which compulsively makes you not only respond, but to continually respond, as if you have nothing else to do with your time. seek help. once i made it clear why i posted, and that it wasn't for you, why would you continue to respond? do you live on this board? do you not have any friends? i bet you would stand in front of a stop sign and argue with it. this is the most i have written on any one thread, in this time frame, in years. find something else to do with your time. get a dog or a cat if you need feedback. and by the way, check the windows feedback and you will see many, many, many others have had problems with this as well. but this is my last time responding to you, as you are starting to feel like a hemorrhoid. i know you will respond again, because you are one of those idiots who just has to get the last word in, even if it is meaningless. so be it. get a life.

 

Yeah, it's ancient *Wink
I'm curious if the native driver works well. Using the AHCI driver for your device doesn't seem to be the correct thing to do. Waiting for an update to AHCI also seems like the wrong methodology - the two are distinct standards.

I'm only drawing on the documents I skimmed. A native NVMe driver for Win8.1 is reported in this article:
Everything you need to know about NVMe, the insanely fast future for SSDs | PCWorld

This might be what you're asking about though - maybe the 'native' NVMe 'driver' is somehow cobbled onto AHCI - I really don't know. If you know, please tell me that's the way it is and I'll stop looking for something that might clear this up for me.

How you set it is beyond me - it might be in BIOS. How that affects SATA drives is also beyond me

I'll defer to your experience since you have one of the devices.

A less confusing title for your thread might have been
When will native NVMe device support be available in Windows 10
- no big deal, it's history
Anyway .... this is not an official MS site - you knew that right?

Have you posted your requirement on the Microsoft community or provided feedback to MS using the feedback app?
That would get the attention of people that can actually affect change *Wink

Windows - Microsoft Community
Windows Insider Program - Microsoft Community

Bill
.

 

hmmmm,

I think the quote below is telling you that you'll need the option ROM and BIOS to natively use the NVMe device.

Again, this might be why you posted - you want the best, fastest, newest .... but then you want the older standard to work because you don't have a supporting ROM and you don't' want to replace your board just to support a drive ... it gets expensive. *Eek

I am guessing a lot here - hope you're enjoying my posts. I'm chuckling a bit when I read yours.

That being said, some of the other articles suggested setting up the drive as Raid 0
Everything you need to know about NVMe, the insanely fast future for SSDs | PCWorld

Consumer SSD | Samsung Semiconductor Global Website

 

yes, i have posted with the feedback app, and tweeted gabe as well. it's the ahci architecture that generally determines the performance of the drive, until nvme becomes more mainstream. yeah, i take it all with a grain of salt. i just wanted to put the word out there on several forums, just to see if someone more knowledgeable than i, has found any solutions, or if ms has done something that they haven't published mainstream. there are many, many times i find new tech that has been out for a bit, and while i comb through the reg conduits of info, i somehow missed it when it hit. so you never know until you try. getting more eyes on it has helped many times in the past.

 

Maybe this is what your asking for.

Recommended AHCI and RAID Drivers

 

I understand and I was of the same thought when I posted the links
- you never know what nugget of information you might find *Wink

Bill
.