Windows 10: Windows 10 to make the Secure Boot alt-OS lock out a reality

Discus and support Windows 10 to make the Secure Boot alt-OS lock out a reality in Windows 10 News to solve the problem; Those of you with long memories will recall a barrage of complaints in the run up to Windows 8's launch that concerned the ability to install other... Discussion in 'Windows 10 News' started by groze, Mar 20, 2015.

  1. groze Win User

    Windows 10 to make the Secure Boot alt-OS lock out a reality


    Source
     
    groze, Mar 20, 2015
    #1
  2. jimbo45 Win User

    Hi there

    I still won't believe this -- as I've posted there are ZILLIONS of machines out there which don't support UEFI let alone secure boot.

    Ms wants as many machines as possible to move away from W7 (and XP of course) so it's not even feasible to THINK about only allowing machines with secure boot functionality to run Windows 10.

    Whatever that source says I still JUST DON'T BELIEVE IT. !!!!! Makes no sense whatsoever.

    Even if NEW machines need secure boot enabled what about older machines -- especially non UEFI machines. If a NON UEFI OS is also allowed then of course UEFI machines will also be able to load it.

    Cheers
    jimbo

    :)
     
    jimbo45, Mar 20, 2015
    #2
  3. suat.cini Win User
    suat.cini, Mar 20, 2015
    #3
  4. MohammadP Win User

    Windows 10 to make the Secure Boot alt-OS lock out a reality

    How to make make a particular OS as default boot.

    Hi

    i recently purchased windows 10 and installed it on my laptop(my previous window was an unOrginal windows 10) , i selected volume 5 when installing.

    it asked me if i want to format drive C and then install the new windows and i said yes.

    but my problem now is that when i turn on my laptop there is 2 volumes and it asks me which volume do i want too choose 3 or 5.

    i dont want this to show again and i want the volume 3 be gone.

    how should i do that ?!?!

    thanks

    Original title:2 operating system
     
    MohammadP, Mar 20, 2015
    #4
  5. groze Win User
    @jimbo45

    I hope you are correct. I want you to be correct. If not, then I see the free software foundation legal department taking care of this problem really quick, especially if you can't dual boot or can't boot to non-windows cd, dvd or usb drive. I have used Mini-wizard partition magic boot cd/dvd to fix issues. I have used Macrium Reflect outside of windows to backup and restore my computer.
     
    groze, Mar 20, 2015
    #5
  6. I'd LIKE to believe that all these recent announcements (e.g., UEFI required, no passwords anymore, and now Secure Boot required) are intended to address ONLY new machines that come with Win10 preloaded -- as the new Win8 machines came with UEFI.

    MS can't have it both ways -- they can't requires features that only the newest hardware will have, while, at the same time, making a big deal about giving away Win10 to (millions?) of Win7 machine owners. If Win10 actually does require all these new hardware features, then it's only going to be installable on a very small percentage of the existing Windows PC base.
     
    Mark Phelps, Mar 20, 2015
    #6
  7. Mystere Win User
    I find it amusing that the freedom loving crowd is crying foul that Microsoft is... giving oem's the freedom to choose.

    Wow, talk about irony.

    Also, you as the customer, have the freedom to choose an OEM that does not choose to limit your options, and those OEM's that give you the options will benefit with more sales.
     
    Mystere, Mar 20, 2015
    #7
  8. groze Win User

    Windows 10 to make the Secure Boot alt-OS lock out a reality

    @Mystere

    That is not the point, it is the end user that should have the right to choose. In the U.S. try finding pre-installed Linux or a BSD or even an apple computer system for around $500.00 USD aside from the mini-mac. Systems with other operating systems are very hard to find at low cost. This may also effect computer shops. There are small business that depend on computer sales.


    I am not leasing the computer from the oem, I am buying it to use an operating system. Now if I want to remove that operating system or dual boot with another, I should be able to and use any operating system of my choice. Once I purchase it, it is my machine not theirs. I should be able to do anything with my system. In fact, I got really *Mad when I first got the windows 7 dell, saying you have to agree to this using to use your computer, no I don't it is mine that possible illegal in the U.S.. I know that dell might of included their own EULA in that but it was all done incorrectly. When I got the dell re-installation disk, I didn't have to agree to that anymore.


    I think even chromebooks you could remove google and install a Linux distro.
     
    groze, Mar 20, 2015
    #8
  9. jimbo45 Win User
    Hi there

    EXACTLY -- imagine the outcry if when buying a Car it said you could only fill up at SHELL gas stations or not drive after 15:00 each day.

    You buy a piece of Hardware. The OS is added on separately -- OK the OS manufacturer can insist on conditions for the user of the OS as you LICENSE the software -- but YOU OWN the hardware.

    Ms have a perfect right to design the OS in any way it choses - but it has NO right to insist on how hardware builders construct their gear. They can say our OS will only run in protected boot mode - that's quite different from saying the computer hardware can ONLY use protected boot. Even on modern hardware you can switch it off if you want to.

    However Ms is shooting itself in the foot if it deliberately tries to restrict the hardware Windows 10 runs on. After the debacle of Windows 8 Ms needs to get as many users as possible to switch from W7 and even XP. Making these sorts of statements about protected boot etc will just put customers off (and probably encourage piracy too).

    Cheers
    jimbo
     
    jimbo45, Mar 20, 2015
    #9
  10. I hope this is not intended to apply to what I'm saying because that has nothing whatsoever to do with what OEMs are going to do.

    I have NO intentions of buying a new machine just to run Win10. So, the OEMs can restrict their machines as much as they want, and that's not going to affect me.

    I am concerned with these announcements implying that MS (not the OEM's) is going to restrict what hardware will be able to run Win10 when it goes into production. These are MS's announcements, not the OEM's announcements.

    I don't want MS to put me into the position that I have to scrap hundreds of dollars of hardware just to install and run Win10.

    Yeah, and everyone is saying that MS is NOT going to do that -- but I've seen nothing coming forward from MS to confirm that -- only presumptions that other folks are making.
     
    Mark Phelps, Mar 20, 2015
    #10
  11. Firstly, it is about "Designed for Windows 10" logo. Secondly, to get the logo, PC now does not have to have the Secure Boot switch turned off, it is now optional. Win 10 will run on any other new PC, even without UEFI, but such PC will not get the label. That is all. At least that is what I read in the linked article...
     
    Olivir2014, Mar 20, 2015
    #11
  12. Mystere Win User
    What announcement are you talking about? Certainly not the one here, since the one here is talking only about what MS is allowing (or rather no longer requiring) OEM's to do.
     
    Mystere, Mar 20, 2015
    #12
  13. Mystere Win User

    Windows 10 to make the Secure Boot alt-OS lock out a reality

    How is that even remotely similar?

    First, The OEM isn't telling you that you can't put a different OS on there. They're just putting in place a mechanism that prevents unsigned OS's from being used (and there are Linux OS's that are signed). The equivalent in your scenario would be if the car company placed a special gas nozzle that would only open for Gas vendors that were approved to put gas in that vehicle.

    And that's certainly within the right of car company to do that if they wanted to, but if they did.. they might not sell very many cars. That's what a free market is about, the consumer choosing to buy or not buy based on their needs.

    But you're really missing the point here. You're complaining because Microsoft is no longer putting a restriction in place on the OEM's, not that Microsoft is forcing the OEM to remove it. Now, the choice of whether to have this is between you and the OEM, not between you and Microsoft.
     
    Mystere, Mar 20, 2015
    #13
  14. groze Win User
    @Mystere

    Microsoft, is telling the OEM it is ok not to let the end not have a choice. My dell system I can't even switch my hard drive to legacy (Not talking about other legacy settings) to install windows 98se. @jimbo45 did make an error, yes they can restrict people to daylight driving. Here is a better analogy. I have a license to drive a car and use an operating system. I also have a right to soup up or unsoup a car anyway I want, I should be able to soup up or unsoup my computer as well by modifying bios or any other setting or hardware that outside of the Operating system.




    All,

    The issue I am more concerned about is avg rescue disk, partition wizard or Macrium reflect working outside of windows operating system.

    I don't know what would happen if you delete the efi partition with secure boot on outside of or even inside of windows using grub or mini-partition wizard. I know you may not be able to boot to windows, would you still be able to install or boot up to a Linux distro and replace windows 10 or would your computer become a paperweight.
     
    groze, Mar 20, 2015
    #14
  15. Winuser Win User
    If the OEMs do decide to remove the secureboot switch that's going to be a problem for anyone wanting to upgrade their video cards. When I upgraded from my on board video card to a Nvidia GeForce card I had to disable secureboot.
     
    Winuser, Mar 20, 2015
    #15
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Windows 10 to make the Secure Boot alt-OS lock out a reality

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